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	<title>Comments on: The Case for Incorporation</title>
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	<description>Following the future of White River Township</description>
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		<title>By: Dann</title>
		<link>http://www.centergroveinc.org/2009/05/07/the-case-for-incorporation/comment-page-1/#comment-731</link>
		<dc:creator>Dann</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sun, 17 May 2009 23:50:29 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.centergroveinc.org/?p=1589#comment-731</guid>
		<description>I think any level of participation that you are willing to take would be welcome. I know you are already providing some advice, when requested to the Reorganization Committee. I certainly appreciate your participation in the discussion here and, as I have offered others, if you care to write a feature article, we will be more than happy to feature it, regardless of the position you may take.&lt;/BR&gt;

I also know that Ryan is looking for volunteers over on http://centergrovetown.org. He is looking for help in gathering signature for incorporation, for people willing to help by hosting their neighbors in awareness sessions and of course he is open to whatever professional services might be offered as well.&lt;/BR&gt;

I am in total agreement that there needs to be a proactive awareness campaign. I&#039;ve asked Larry Hilkene if White River Citizens United might be willing to provide some funding for such a campaign, but he said right now they would like to learn more about the options before taking any action. My brother an I have have spent some money advertising our web site on 95.9 WFDM in Franklin (&lt;a href=&quot;http://www.freedom959.com/&quot; rel=&quot;nofollow&quot;&gt;http://www.freedom959.com/&lt;/a&gt;), but it&#039;s hard to come up with significant funds directly out of our own pocket.&lt;/BR&gt;

I like your idea of taking the message to where the people are. I don&#039;t think it would be a huge effort to put something together, given all the work that has been done so far, the harder question is what are the venues? Do you have any more thoughts on that? You can respond either in the comments or via e-mail to centergroveinc@gmail.com.&lt;/BR&gt;

Dann</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>I think any level of participation that you are willing to take would be welcome. I know you are already providing some advice, when requested to the Reorganization Committee. I certainly appreciate your participation in the discussion here and, as I have offered others, if you care to write a feature article, we will be more than happy to feature it, regardless of the position you may take.</p>
<p>I also know that Ryan is looking for volunteers over on <a href="http://centergrovetown.org" rel="nofollow">http://centergrovetown.org</a>. He is looking for help in gathering signature for incorporation, for people willing to help by hosting their neighbors in awareness sessions and of course he is open to whatever professional services might be offered as well.</p>
<p>I am in total agreement that there needs to be a proactive awareness campaign. I&#8217;ve asked Larry Hilkene if White River Citizens United might be willing to provide some funding for such a campaign, but he said right now they would like to learn more about the options before taking any action. My brother an I have have spent some money advertising our web site on 95.9 WFDM in Franklin (<a href="http://www.freedom959.com/" rel="nofollow">http://www.freedom959.com/</a>), but it&#8217;s hard to come up with significant funds directly out of our own pocket.</p>
<p>I like your idea of taking the message to where the people are. I don&#8217;t think it would be a huge effort to put something together, given all the work that has been done so far, the harder question is what are the venues? Do you have any more thoughts on that? You can respond either in the comments or via e-mail to <a href="mailto:centergroveinc@gmail.com">centergroveinc@gmail.com</a>.</p>
<p>Dann</p>
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		<title>By: Andrew Klinger</title>
		<link>http://www.centergroveinc.org/2009/05/07/the-case-for-incorporation/comment-page-1/#comment-725</link>
		<dc:creator>Andrew Klinger</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Fri, 15 May 2009 21:16:31 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.centergroveinc.org/?p=1589#comment-725</guid>
		<description>Thanks, I appreciate the responses. I generally prefer the self-incorporation concept, but have had concerns about whether it is realistic, as I expressed in my earlier comment.  I still believe that there is a long road to haul, but I must admit that you have presented a convincing argument on the possibility of success.  

It is tied to the level of support within the community.  I agree that if enough residents of the unincorporated township signed onto an incorporation petition, then the Greenwood City Council would be hard pressed to reject the consensus opinion of the citizens.  If the Council still rejected a petition in spite of wide spread support, then a very strong argument could be made to the General Assembly that the outcome was unjust and the law needs to be changed.  An entity, over which the people have no electoral authority, should not be able to subvert the obvious will of the people.  So, I will admit that a possibility for incorporation does exist and it is dependent upon the level of support within the community.  

I think that Mr. Veldkamp is right.  It will be very important to engage the Greenwood Common Council members early in the process in order to exchange views and discuss possibilities. But, more importantly, the GCC will have a role in deciding what measure of support is necessary to be successful.  How many signatures or what other efforts are necessary to be successful? 

My real concern is that there is no real consensus within the community at this point.  This is true regardless of whether we are talking about incorporation or merger.  As I suggested with the Reorganization Committee, what this community needs is a consensus building process.  The community is at a crossroads.  The development of the township combined with outside forces has put us in a position where we must choose one of several directions for the future of the community.  A choice must be made or the outcome may be thrust upon us from outside sources.  If the incorporation movement is to succeed, it will be because it focused its efforts on reaching out and building consensus.  

I believe a fundamental step to attaining consensus is first achieving awareness of the changes that the community is facing and arming people with information.  Some of this has already occurred through this website and past open forums, but it seems the process has been largely passive.  It needs to become an active process.  Efforts to reach out to the community need to be made.  You have to go where the people are.  Go to neighborhood associations, go to community groups, go to churches, and anywhere that the residents of WRT gather.  Give them good, balanced information about who we are as a community (back it up with data), where we stand at the crossroads, what the options are for the future, and what the consequences of those different directions may be.  

The options, as I see it, are annexation, merger, incorporation, or the status quo.  Yes, I included the status quo option.  I may have dismissed the incorporation option too easily.  I will not make the same mistake with the status quo option and would strongly encourage everyone to leave it on the table as well.  Many residents still cling to the “just leave us alone” mantra. 

However, what many of those people don’t understand is that, just like the other options, the status quo won’t just happen on its own.  Annexation efforts have already been pursued by Greenwood and Bargersville.  It is possible that an annexation attempt could be successfully fended off by WRT residents, but only if someone actively pursues it and pays the cost of litigation.  In other words, the status quo will have to be defended with resources and a centralized effort, not unlike the reorganization or incorporation efforts.  Maintaining the status quo is an option, but no one should be disillusioned into thinking that they can sit back and things will simply remain the same.  

When all options have been presented, then simply ask the question: how do you want the governing structure of this community to take shape?  I think if it is presented under these circumstances the incorporation option will be the preferred selection.  I doubt much effort would need to be put into selling it.  And a consensus will begin to build.  

I would love to see the incorporation movement take this direction and fill this much needed role of building consensus.  People are much more likely to support a plan that they have had input in creating.  From the looks of the website, the hard work has begun.  As I indicated before, I would love to participate in the process.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Thanks, I appreciate the responses. I generally prefer the self-incorporation concept, but have had concerns about whether it is realistic, as I expressed in my earlier comment.  I still believe that there is a long road to haul, but I must admit that you have presented a convincing argument on the possibility of success.  </p>
<p>It is tied to the level of support within the community.  I agree that if enough residents of the unincorporated township signed onto an incorporation petition, then the Greenwood City Council would be hard pressed to reject the consensus opinion of the citizens.  If the Council still rejected a petition in spite of wide spread support, then a very strong argument could be made to the General Assembly that the outcome was unjust and the law needs to be changed.  An entity, over which the people have no electoral authority, should not be able to subvert the obvious will of the people.  So, I will admit that a possibility for incorporation does exist and it is dependent upon the level of support within the community.  </p>
<p>I think that Mr. Veldkamp is right.  It will be very important to engage the Greenwood Common Council members early in the process in order to exchange views and discuss possibilities. But, more importantly, the GCC will have a role in deciding what measure of support is necessary to be successful.  How many signatures or what other efforts are necessary to be successful? </p>
<p>My real concern is that there is no real consensus within the community at this point.  This is true regardless of whether we are talking about incorporation or merger.  As I suggested with the Reorganization Committee, what this community needs is a consensus building process.  The community is at a crossroads.  The development of the township combined with outside forces has put us in a position where we must choose one of several directions for the future of the community.  A choice must be made or the outcome may be thrust upon us from outside sources.  If the incorporation movement is to succeed, it will be because it focused its efforts on reaching out and building consensus.  </p>
<p>I believe a fundamental step to attaining consensus is first achieving awareness of the changes that the community is facing and arming people with information.  Some of this has already occurred through this website and past open forums, but it seems the process has been largely passive.  It needs to become an active process.  Efforts to reach out to the community need to be made.  You have to go where the people are.  Go to neighborhood associations, go to community groups, go to churches, and anywhere that the residents of WRT gather.  Give them good, balanced information about who we are as a community (back it up with data), where we stand at the crossroads, what the options are for the future, and what the consequences of those different directions may be.  </p>
<p>The options, as I see it, are annexation, merger, incorporation, or the status quo.  Yes, I included the status quo option.  I may have dismissed the incorporation option too easily.  I will not make the same mistake with the status quo option and would strongly encourage everyone to leave it on the table as well.  Many residents still cling to the “just leave us alone” mantra. </p>
<p>However, what many of those people don’t understand is that, just like the other options, the status quo won’t just happen on its own.  Annexation efforts have already been pursued by Greenwood and Bargersville.  It is possible that an annexation attempt could be successfully fended off by WRT residents, but only if someone actively pursues it and pays the cost of litigation.  In other words, the status quo will have to be defended with resources and a centralized effort, not unlike the reorganization or incorporation efforts.  Maintaining the status quo is an option, but no one should be disillusioned into thinking that they can sit back and things will simply remain the same.  </p>
<p>When all options have been presented, then simply ask the question: how do you want the governing structure of this community to take shape?  I think if it is presented under these circumstances the incorporation option will be the preferred selection.  I doubt much effort would need to be put into selling it.  And a consensus will begin to build.  </p>
<p>I would love to see the incorporation movement take this direction and fill this much needed role of building consensus.  People are much more likely to support a plan that they have had input in creating.  From the looks of the website, the hard work has begun.  As I indicated before, I would love to participate in the process.</p>
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		<title>By: Ryan Rhoten</title>
		<link>http://www.centergroveinc.org/2009/05/07/the-case-for-incorporation/comment-page-1/#comment-721</link>
		<dc:creator>Ryan Rhoten</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sun, 10 May 2009 18:34:23 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.centergroveinc.org/?p=1589#comment-721</guid>
		<description>Mr. Klinger,

I apologize for not getting back to this sooner.  I have been very busy keeping up with my site:  www.centergrovetown.org.  It seems that there are many of our fellow WRT citizens interested in becoming Center Grove, Indiana.  By getting involved, they are turning their “dreams” for our area into actions.    

You pose an interesting question, “Why would the Greenwood City Council adopt a resolution allowing incorporation of the Town of Center Grove?”  The truth of the matter is that I cannot speak for the Greenwood City Council.  Why they would or would not allow self incorporation to happen is something that must be asked of them not me.  But let me ask this question.  If you were a member of the Greenwood City Council and a group of citizens approached the council with the signatures of 20,000 citizens who wanted to form their own city next to yours, what would you do?  I think if there were only 100, 500, 1,000 or even 2,000 signatures, you might not be swayed, but 20,000?  

Self-incorporation is a movement that must be enacted by the citizens.  Without our support and willingness to get involved, we can go no where.  Many have surmised that we should have done this “years ago”, or have given up because they feel “it’s too late”.  Remember that nothing has been decided.  Should the re-organization effort fail by vote, we need to be ready the very next day (preferably sooner) to file a petition to incorporate.  If we do not get involved and act now, then I am afraid that you are correct and we will be “doomed to competing annexations and litigation for the next decade”.  

Yes, there are many obstacles on the path to incorporation.  You have noted one.  But I will maintain that the more support we have the easier those obstacles will be to overcome.  Of course, we&#039;ll never know if we don&#039;t try.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Mr. Klinger,</p>
<p>I apologize for not getting back to this sooner.  I have been very busy keeping up with my site:  <a href="http://www.centergrovetown.org" rel="nofollow">http://www.centergrovetown.org</a>.  It seems that there are many of our fellow WRT citizens interested in becoming Center Grove, Indiana.  By getting involved, they are turning their “dreams” for our area into actions.    </p>
<p>You pose an interesting question, “Why would the Greenwood City Council adopt a resolution allowing incorporation of the Town of Center Grove?”  The truth of the matter is that I cannot speak for the Greenwood City Council.  Why they would or would not allow self incorporation to happen is something that must be asked of them not me.  But let me ask this question.  If you were a member of the Greenwood City Council and a group of citizens approached the council with the signatures of 20,000 citizens who wanted to form their own city next to yours, what would you do?  I think if there were only 100, 500, 1,000 or even 2,000 signatures, you might not be swayed, but 20,000?  </p>
<p>Self-incorporation is a movement that must be enacted by the citizens.  Without our support and willingness to get involved, we can go no where.  Many have surmised that we should have done this “years ago”, or have given up because they feel “it’s too late”.  Remember that nothing has been decided.  Should the re-organization effort fail by vote, we need to be ready the very next day (preferably sooner) to file a petition to incorporate.  If we do not get involved and act now, then I am afraid that you are correct and we will be “doomed to competing annexations and litigation for the next decade”.  </p>
<p>Yes, there are many obstacles on the path to incorporation.  You have noted one.  But I will maintain that the more support we have the easier those obstacles will be to overcome.  Of course, we&#8217;ll never know if we don&#8217;t try.</p>
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